Subject: RE: GraGraph home earthquake meter From: "Kareem of Heyjoojoo" system98765@............. Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2007 13:13:00 -0700 I thought it was $85 but that link shows $159... (american dollars) -----Original Message----- From: psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... On Behalf Of JimT Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 8:40 AM To: psn-l@.............. Subject: Re: GraGraph home earthquake meter There is more info on this page: http://www.kilian-nakamura.com/catalog/gragraph-home-earthquake-seismograph- p-176.html Here is what it says: The Gragraph is a home seismograph that warns you as an earthquake is occurring, measures the intensity, and records the data in its calendar. The verbal warnings are in Japanese, but the digital data can be easily accessed in any language. In normal mode, the Gragraph serves as a tabletop calendar/clock and a reference for past activity. Gragraph features: .. Perceives shaking, and indicates on display . Warns of shaking with sound and voice . Indicates level from 3-10 . Keeps record of previous seismic activity . During the night, it activates a safety light . Calendar/Clock function Jim Turner On 9/29/07, psn-l-digest-request@.............. wrote: > > .------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------. > | Message 1 | > '------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------' > Subject: GraGraph home earthquake meter > From: "David Saum" > Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2007 18:40:00 -0400 > > Japanese > http://www.gragraph.jp/ > > English > http://blog.scifi.com/tech/archives/2007/09/28/gragraph_home_e.html __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Fast Moment Ternsor List??? From: Dave Nelson davenn@............... Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2007 09:47:23 +1000 Hi Stephen, yeah damn annoying, some weeks ago I emailed Madelene Zirbies who is one of the ones looking after the www site. She was aware of it and seemed to indicate that it wasnt going to get fixed any time soon. the other data available under the Scientific & Technical tab just isnt the same :( for one it doesnt have the nice world map image with the "beachball" on it that I had saved on puter for many years. also the data is in a different format. also the "Global CMT Project Moment Tensor Solution" info now being supplied lists events Mw6.0 and higher and some times only the high events eg M6.6 up cheers Dave N Sydney At 11:27 AM 9/30/2007 -0700, you wrote: >Question,, anyone know why the FM Tensor List is stuck at 14 Aug 2007? >I know that I can get the info in a few days under the Scientific & >Technical tab of the individual quakes at NEIC, but was wondering what >happened to their FM Tensor list at the following link??? >http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/FM/ > Stephen > PSN #55 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Fast Moment Ternsor List??? From: John Lahr johnjan@........ Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2007 14:29:38 -0700 Here's the word from the USGS. Cheers, John Because of Department of Interior security requirements, we had to install a number of new routers in our internal network. At that point some of our processes that depended on communication between different subnets stopped working. In other words, some of our programs broke. Most of the problems were fixed on the first day, but we are still unable to compute the moment tensors. We have been working on a new, faster experimental system, with an improved user interface, for generating the moment tensors. Since this is the direction we were already committed to, we have decided to accelerate implementation of the new system. In the near future we hope to be computing moment tensors again, using the new system. You may want to take a look at the USGS Earthquake Notification Service (ENS) at http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/ens/. These notifications, at this time, will not include the "beachball", but will be A LOT faster. They are also very easy to customize in terms of geographic region(s) of interest and magnitude threshold. You may end up preferring these to the moment tensor solutions. At 04:47 PM 9/30/2007, you wrote: >Hi Stephen, > yeah damn annoying, some weeks ago I emailed > Madelene Zirbies > who is one of the ones looking after the www site. She was aware of it and >seemed to indicate that it wasnt going to get fixed any time soon. > > the other data available under the Scientific & Technical tab just >isnt the same :( for one it doesnt have the nice world map image with the >"beachball" on it that I had saved on puter for many years. also >the data is in >a different format. also the "Global CMT Project Moment Tensor >Solution" info >now being supplied lists events Mw6.0 and higher and some times >only the high >events eg M6.6 up > >cheers >Dave N >Sydney > > > >At 11:27 AM 9/30/2007 -0700, you wrote: >>Question,, anyone know why the FM Tensor List is stuck at 14 Aug 2007? >>I know that I can get the info in a few days under the Scientific & >>Technical tab of the individual quakes at NEIC, but was wondering >>what happened to their FM Tensor list at the following link??? >>http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/FM/ >> Stephen >> PSN #55 > > >-- >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: >269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM > > >__________________________________________________________ > >Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) > >To leave this list email PSN-L-REQUEST@.............. with the body >of the message (first line only): unsubscribe >See http://www.seismicnet.com/maillist.html for more information. > __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Fast Moment Ternsor List??? From: Dave Nelson davenn@............... Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 07:53:09 +1000 Thanks John nice to have an official explanation, hopefully we will see the "beachball maps again one day soon. Yes I have been logged onto the ENS for some years and it is a good fast notification of new events. cheers Dave At 02:29 PM 10/1/2007 -0700, you wrote: >Here's the word from the USGS. Cheers, John > Because of Department of Interior security requirements, we had to > install a number of new routers in our internal network. At that point > some of our processes that depended on communication between different > subnets stopped working. In other words, some of our programs broke. > Most of the problems were fixed on the first day, but we are still > unable to compute the moment tensors. > We have been working on a new, faster experimental system, with an > improved user interface, for generating the moment tensors. Since this > is the direction we were already committed to, we have decided to > accelerate implementation of the new system. In the near future we hope > to be computing moment tensors again, using the new system. > You may want to take a look at the USGS Earthquake Notification Service > (ENS) at http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/ens/. These notifications, > at this time, will not include the "beachball", but will be A LOT > faster. They are also very easy to customize in terms of geographic > region(s) of interest and magnitude threshold. You may end up preferring > these to the moment tensor solutions. > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.35/1040 - Release Date: 9/30/2007 9:01 PM __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Fast Moment Ternsor List??? Working!!! From: Stephen & Kathy skmort@............ Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2007 18:57:49 -0700 Wouldn't you know,, we must have jarred something loose,, ha,, I just checked and today it is working,,, thanks to all. Stephen PSN #55 John Lahr wrote: > Here's the word from the USGS. Cheers, John > > Because of Department of Interior security requirements, we had to > install a number of new routers in our internal network. At that point > some of our processes that depended on communication between different > subnets stopped working. In other words, some of our programs broke. > Most of the problems were fixed on the first day, but we are still > unable to compute the moment tensors. > > > We have been working on a new, faster experimental system, with an > improved user interface, for generating the moment tensors. Since this > is the direction we were already committed to, we have decided to > accelerate implementation of the new system. In the near future we > hope > to be computing moment tensors again, using the new system. > > > You may want to take a look at the USGS Earthquake Notification > Service > (ENS) at http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/ens/. These > notifications, > at this time, will not include the "beachball", but will be A LOT > faster. They are also very easy to customize in terms of geographic > region(s) of interest and magnitude threshold. You may end up > preferring > these to the moment tensor solutions. > > > > > > > At 04:47 PM 9/30/2007, you wrote: >> Hi Stephen, >> yeah damn annoying, some weeks ago I emailed >> Madelene Zirbies >> who is one of the ones looking after the www site. She was aware >> of it and >> seemed to indicate that it wasnt going to get fixed any time soon. >> >> the other data available under the Scientific & Technical tab just >> isnt the same :( for one it doesnt have the nice world map image >> with the >> "beachball" on it that I had saved on puter for many years. also >> the data is in >> a different format. also the "Global CMT Project Moment Tensor >> Solution" info >> now being supplied lists events Mw6.0 and higher and some times >> only the high >> events eg M6.6 up >> >> cheers >> Dave N >> Sydney >> >> >> >> At 11:27 AM 9/30/2007 -0700, you wrote: >>> Question,, anyone know why the FM Tensor List is stuck at 14 Aug 2007? >>> I know that I can get the info in a few days under the Scientific & >>> Technical tab of the individual quakes at NEIC, but was wondering >>> what happened to their FM Tensor list at the following link??? >>> http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/FM/ >>> Stephen >>> PSN #55 >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: >> 269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM >> >> >> __________________________________________________________ >> >> Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) >> >> To leave this list email PSN-L-REQUEST@.............. with the body >> of the message (first line only): unsubscribe >> See http://www.seismicnet.com/maillist.html for more information. >> > > > __________________________________________________________ > > Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) > > To leave this list email PSN-L-REQUEST@.............. with the body of > the message (first line only): unsubscribe > See http://www.seismicnet.com/maillist.html for more information. > Wouldn't you know,,  we must have jarred something loose,, ha,,  I just checked and today it is working,,,   thanks to all.
  Stephen
  PSN #55

John Lahr wrote:
Here's the word from the USGS.  Cheers, John

   Because of Department of Interior security requirements, we had to
   install a number of new routers in our internal network. At that point
   some of our processes that depended on communication between different
   subnets stopped working. In other words, some of our programs broke.
   Most of the problems were fixed on the first day, but we are still
   unable to compute the moment tensors.


   We have been working on a new, faster experimental system, with an
   improved user interface, for generating the moment tensors. Since this
   is the direction we were already committed to, we have decided to
   accelerate implementation of the new system. In the near future we hope
   to be computing moment tensors again, using the new system.


   You may want to take a look at the USGS Earthquake Notification Service
   (ENS) at http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/ens/. These notifications,
   at this time, will not include the "beachball", but will be A LOT
   faster. They are also very easy to customize in terms of geographic
   region(s) of interest and magnitude threshold. You may end up preferring
   these to the moment tensor solutions.






At 04:47 PM 9/30/2007, you wrote:
Hi Stephen,
                  yeah damn annoying,   some weeks ago I emailed Madelene Zirbies
 who is one of the ones looking after the www site.   She was aware of it and
seemed to indicate that it wasnt going to get fixed any time soon.

 the other data available  under the Scientific & Technical tab  just
isnt the same  :(  for one  it doesnt have the nice world map  image with the
"beachball" on it that I had saved on puter for many years.   also the data is in
a different format.  also the  "Global CMT Project Moment Tensor Solution"  info
now being supplied  lists events Mw6.0 and higher  and some times only the high
events  eg  M6.6 up

cheers
Dave N
Sydney



At 11:27 AM 9/30/2007 -0700, you wrote:
Question,, anyone know why the FM Tensor List is stuck at 14 Aug 2007?
I know that I can get the info in a few days under the Scientific & Technical tab of the individual quakes at NEIC, but was wondering what happened to their FM Tensor list at the following link???
<http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/FM/>http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/FM/
 Stephen
 PSN #55


--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.35/1039 - Release Date: 9/29/2007 9:46 PM


__________________________________________________________

Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L)

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See http://www.seismicnet.com/maillist.html for more information.



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Subject: San Andreas drilling From: ian ian@........... Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2007 09:05:08 +0100 interesting story about recovering rocks from deep inside the fault: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7030660.stm Ian __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: WinQuake Display Question From: "Jerry Payton" gpayton880@....... Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:01:05 -0500 (Question 1): On a WinQuake event display are the P and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival times or shown according to what the table says they should be? (Question 2): Is the distance from the event to your seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the surface?" Thank you, Jerry Payton
(Question 1):    On a WinQuake event display = are the=20 P and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival times = or=20 shown according to what the table says they should be?
 
(Question 2):    Is the distance from the event to=20 your seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the=20 surface?"
 
Thank you,
Jerry Payton
 
 
 
 
Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question From: tchannel1@............ Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:55:46 -0600 Hi Jerry, "I Think"................Q 1 The p and s and other = phases if you use them are all based on (time theory) =20 The math program knows where you are and where the event took place, it = converts that info to Miles, also to Degrees. It then uses one of several formulas, I use the default formula, to = place the p and s on a time line, which is on the bottom of the Winquake = screen. Q2.........The distance is "around the surface" like a string on a = globe. This is all "great circle" math. So the program is simple for this part, because, it take the event Long. = and Lat, your Long. and Lat, the time of the event, does the math (the = p travels about 10km per second), I calculate it is about 28,000 miles = per hour, and figure it would take the P, say 12.002 minute to reach = you, add that, to the event time, and places the P on your screen = accordingly. It does not read you recording, you could have recorded a truck or a = train and if the event matched your train in would place the p and s, on = the time line. Is this clear??????????????????? Ted ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jerry Payton=20 To: psn-l@................. Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: WinQuake Display Question (Question 1): On a WinQuake event display are the P and S arrival = times showning the ACTUAL arrival times or shown according to what the = table says they should be? (Question 2): Is the distance from the event to your seismograph = computed "through the earth" or "around the surface?" Thank you, Jerry Payton
Hi Jerry,  "I = Think"................Q=20 1        The p and s and other phases = if you=20 use them are all based on (time theory)  
The math program knows where you are = and where the=20 event took place, it converts that info to Miles, also to = Degrees.
It then uses one of several = formulas, I use=20 the default formula, to place the p and s on a time line, which is = on the=20 bottom of the Winquake screen.
 
Q2.........The distance is "around the = surface"=20 like a string on a globe.   This is all "great circle"=20 math.
 
So the program is simple for this part, = because, it=20 take the event Long. and Lat,  your Long. and Lat, the time of the = event,=20 does the math (the p travels about 10km per second), I calculate it is = about=20 28,000 miles per hour, and figure it would take the P, say  12.002 = minute=20 to reach you, add that, to the event time, and places the P on your = screen=20 accordingly.
 
It does not read you recording,  = you could=20 have recorded a truck or a train and if the event matched your train in = would=20 place the p and s, on the time line.
 
Is this = clear???????????????????  =20 Ted
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Jerry = Payton=20
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 = 1:01=20 PM
Subject: WinQuake Display = Question

(Question 1):    On a WinQuake event display = are the=20 P and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival = times or=20 shown according to what the table says they should be?
 
(Question 2):    Is the distance from the event to = your seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the=20 surface?"
 
Thank you,
Jerry Payton
 
 
 
 
Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question From: "Jerry Payton" gpayton880@....... Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 16:46:17 -0500 Yes, you answer IS clear. I suspected that it was a "Great Circle" measurement, but wanted verification. However, I was curious about the phase-time travel. Wave propagation through the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon the materials it travels through, reflections, refractions and etc. I guess that the "tables" are basically averages taken from measurements over the years and reasonably accurate. What prompted my question was reading about the construction of the "beachball" Focal Mechanism Solution. They look at the P wave arrival and depending upon whether it goes up or down determines one of the factors of the final solution. Thus, exact timing is needed. If the P wave is arbitrarily identified, the solution would be false. (I think???) Thank you, Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: tchannel1@............ To: psn-l@.............. Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 3:55 PM Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question Hi Jerry, "I Think"................Q 1 The p and s and other phases if you use them are all based on (time theory) The math program knows where you are and where the event took place, it converts that info to Miles, also to Degrees. It then uses one of several formulas, I use the default formula, to place the p and s on a time line, which is on the bottom of the Winquake screen. Q2.........The distance is "around the surface" like a string on a globe. This is all "great circle" math. So the program is simple for this part, because, it take the event Long. and Lat, your Long. and Lat, the time of the event, does the math (the p travels about 10km per second), I calculate it is about 28,000 miles per hour, and figure it would take the P, say 12.002 minute to reach you, add that, to the event time, and places the P on your screen accordingly. It does not read you recording, you could have recorded a truck or a train and if the event matched your train in would place the p and s, on the time line. Is this clear??????????????????? Ted ----- Original Message ----- From: Jerry Payton To: psn-l@.............. Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: WinQuake Display Question (Question 1): On a WinQuake event display are the P and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival times or shown according to what the table says they should be? (Question 2): Is the distance from the event to your seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the surface?" Thank you, Jerry Payton
Yes, you answer IS clear.  I suspected that it was a "Great = Circle"=20 measurement, but wanted verification.
 
However, I was curious about the phase-time travel.  Wave = propagation=20 through the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon the = materials it=20 travels through, reflections, refractions and etc.  I guess that = the=20 "tables" are basically averages taken from measurements over the years = and=20 reasonably accurate.
 
What prompted my question was reading about the construction = of the=20 "beachball" Focal Mechanism Solution.  They look at the P wave = arrival and=20 depending upon whether it goes up or down determines one of the factors = of the=20 final solution.  Thus, exact timing is needed.  If the P wave = is=20 arbitrarily identified, the solution would be false.  (I = think???)
 
Thank you,
Jerry
 
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: tchannel1@............
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question

Hi Jerry,  "I = Think"................Q=20 1        The p and s and other phases = if you=20 use them are all based on (time theory)  
The math program knows where you are = and where the=20 event took place, it converts that info to Miles, also to = Degrees.
It then uses one of several = formulas, I use=20 the default formula, to place the p and s on a time line, which is = on the=20 bottom of the Winquake screen.
 
Q2.........The distance is "around the = surface"=20 like a string on a globe.   This is all "great circle"=20 math.
 
So the program is simple for this part, = because, it=20 take the event Long. and Lat,  your Long. and Lat, the time of the = event,=20 does the math (the p travels about 10km per second), I calculate it is = about=20 28,000 miles per hour, and figure it would take the P, say  12.002 = minute=20 to reach you, add that, to the event time, and places the P on your = screen=20 accordingly.
 
It does not read you recording,  = you could=20 have recorded a truck or a train and if the event matched your train in = would=20 place the p and s, on the time line.
 
Is this = clear???????????????????  =20 Ted
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Jerry = Payton=20
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 = 1:01=20 PM
Subject: WinQuake Display = Question

(Question 1):    On a WinQuake event display = are the=20 P and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival = times or=20 shown according to what the table says they should be?
 
(Question 2):    Is the distance from the event to = your seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the=20 surface?"
 
Thank you,
Jerry Payton
 
 
 
 
Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question From: Bob Hancock carpediem1@......... Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2007 17:24:42 -0700 There are both body waves which travel through the earth=B9s mantel and core, and surface waves which follow the crust. The P & S waves and their variations are body waves. The LQ and LR waves are surface waves and follo= w the surface of the earth. These waves also have different dissipation rates.=20 Alan Jones program Seismic Waves gives a good presentation of the major waves. You can download it from the following link: http://www.geol.binghamton.edu/faculty/jones/ Using WinQuake, the wave arrival times are computed based upon standard wav= e speeds depending upon the route the waves take, and the depth of the event. The data is computed using the latitude and longitude of the event and the station recording the event. Bob Hancock On 10/9/07 2:46 PM, "Jerry Payton" wrote: > Yes, you answer IS clear. I suspected that it was a "Great Circle" > measurement, but wanted verification. > =20 > However, I was curious about the phase-time travel. Wave propagation thr= ough > the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon the materials it trav= els > through, reflections, refractions and etc. I guess that the "tables" are > basically averages taken from measurements over the years and reasonably > accurate. > =20 > What prompted my question was reading about the construction of the > "beachball" Focal Mechanism Solution. They look at the P wave arrival an= d > depending upon whether it goes up or down determines one of the factors o= f the > final solution. Thus, exact timing is needed. If the P wave is arbitrar= ily > identified, the solution would be false. (I think???) > =20 > Thank you, > Jerry > =20 > =20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: tchannel1@............ > To: psn-l@.............. > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 3:55 PM > Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question >=20 > Hi Jerry, "I Think"................Q 1 The p and s and other phas= es if > you use them are all based on (time theory) > The math program knows where you are and where the event took place, it > converts that info to Miles, also to Degrees. > It then uses one of several formulas, I use the default formula, to place= the > p and s on a time line, which is on the bottom of the Winquake screen. > =20 > Q2.........The distance is "around the surface" like a string on a globe. > This is all "great circle" math. > =20 > So the program is simple for this part, because, it take the event Long. = and > Lat, your Long. and Lat, the time of the event, does the math (the p tra= vels > about 10km per second), I calculate it is about 28,000 miles per hour, an= d > figure it would take the P, say 12.002 minute to reach you, add that, to= the > event time, and places the P on your screen accordingly. > =20 > It does not read you recording, you could have recorded a truck or a tra= in > and if the event matched your train in would place the p and s, on the ti= me > line. > =20 > Is this clear??????????????????? Ted >> =20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> =20 >> From: Jerry Payton >> =20 >> To: psn-l@.............. >> =20 >> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:01 PM >> =20 >> Subject: WinQuake Display Question >> =20 >>=20 >> =20 >> (Question 1): On a WinQuake event display are the P and S arrival ti= mes >> showning the ACTUAL arrival times or shown according to what the table = says >> they should be? >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> (Question 2): Is the distance from the event to your seismograph com= puted >> "through the earth" or "around the surface?" >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> Thank you, >> =20 >> Jerry Payton >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >=20 Re: WinQuake Display Question There= are both body waves which travel through the earth’s mantel and core,= and surface waves which follow the crust.  The P & S waves and the= ir variations are body waves.  The LQ and LR waves are surface waves an= d follow the surface of the earth.  These waves also have different dis= sipation rates.

Alan Jones program Seismic Waves gives a good presentation of the major wav= es.  You can download it from the following link:

        http://www.geol.binghamton.edu/faculty/jones/

Using WinQuake, the wave arrival times are computed based upon standard wav= e speeds depending upon the route the waves take, and the depth of the event= ..

The data is computed using the latitude and longitude of the event and the = station recording the event.

Bob Hancock


On 10/9/07 2:46 PM, "Jerry Payton" <gpayton880@.......> wro= te:

Yes, you answer IS clear.  I suspected that it was= a "Great Circle" measurement, but wanted verification.
 
However, I was curious about the phase-time travel.  Wave propagation = through the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon the materials it= travels through, reflections, refractions and etc.  I guess that the &= quot;tables" are basically averages taken from measurements over the ye= ars and reasonably accurate.
 
What prompted my question was reading about the construction of the "b= eachball" Focal Mechanism Solution.  They look at the P wave arriv= al and depending upon whether it goes up or down determines one of the facto= rs of the final solution.  Thus, exact timing is needed.  If the P= wave is arbitrarily identified, the solution would be false.  (I think= ???)
 
Thank you,
Jerry
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: tchannel1@............
To: psn-l@..............
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question

Hi Jerry, &= nbsp;"I Think"................Q 1      &n= bsp; The p and s and other phases if you use them are all based on (tim= e theory)   
The math program knows where you are and where the event took place, it con= verts that info to Miles, also to Degrees.
It then uses one of several formulas, I use the default formula, to place t= he p and s on a time line, which is on the bottom of the Winquake screen.
Q2.........The distance is "around the surfa= ce" like a string on a globe.   This is all "great circl= e" math.
So the program is simple for this part, because, = it take the event Long. and Lat,  your Long. and Lat, the time of the e= vent, does the math (the p travels about 10km per second), I calculate it is= about 28,000 miles per hour, and figure it would take the P, say  12.0= 02 minute to reach you, add that, to the event time, and places the P on you= r screen accordingly.
It does not read you recording,  you could h= ave recorded a truck or a train and if the event matched your train in would= place the p and s, on the time line.
Is this clear???????????????????   Ted<= BR>

----- Original Message -----
 
From:  Jerry Payton <mai= lto:gpayton880@.......>   
 
To: psn-l@..............
 
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:01  PM
 
Subject: WinQuake Display Question
 

 
(Question 1):    On a WinQuake event display are the  P= and S arrival times showning the ACTUAL arrival times or  shown= according to what the table says they should be?
 
 
 
(Question 2):    Is the distance from the event to  you= r seismograph computed "through the earth" or "around the &nb= sp;surface?"
 
 
 
Thank you,
 
Jerry Payton
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


 Subject: Re: WinQuake Display Question From: ChrisAtUpw@....... Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 20:50:59 EDT In a message dated 09/10/2007 22:46:38 GMT Daylight Time, gpayton880@....... writes: Wave propagation through the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon the materials it travels through, reflections, refractions and etc. I guess that the "tables" are basically averages taken from measurements over the years and reasonably accurate. The wave velocities are mostly determined by depth, so it is possible to plot average curves for the time travel along the curved ray paths. You may also have to allow for the depth of the quake. Seismic Waves and Seismic Eruptions give good visualisation of the principle waves. See Alan Jones website at _http://www.geol.binghamton.edu/faculty/jones/_ (http://www.geol.binghamton.edu/faculty/jones/) Regards, Chris Chapman
In a message dated 09/10/2007 22:46:38 GMT Daylight Time,=20 gpayton880@....... writes:
<= FONT=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=3DArial color=3D#000000>Wave=20 propagation through the earth is a highly variable thing depending upon th= e=20 materials it travels through, reflections, refractions and etc.  I gu= ess=20 that the "tables" are basically averages taken from measurements over the=20 years and reasonably accurate.
    The wave velocities are mostly determined by de= pth,=20 so it is possible to plot average curves for the time travel along the curve= d=20 ray paths. You may also have to allow for the depth of the quake.
 
    Seismic Waves and Seismic=20 Eruptions give good visualisation of the principle waves.  See Alan Jon= es=20 website at http://www.geol.binghamton.edu/faculty/jones/
    Regards,
 
    Chris Chapman
Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: "meredith lamb" paleoartifact@......... Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 19:28:02 -0600 Hi all, I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real "engineers"; to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for acouple pictures of a item at: http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; whats yours? Meredith Lamb
Hi all,
 
I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real "engineers";
to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for acouple pictures of a item at:
 
 
I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; whats yours?
 
Meredith Lamb
 
 
Subject: Travel times From: "Randy Pratt" rpratt@............. Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 17:28:44 -0500 Hi All, I saw the question on travel times and had just come across this page a couple nights back showing some plots of times and locations. http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/ttdata.shtml Randy
Hi=20 All,
 
I saw = the question=20 on travel times and had just come across this page a couple nights back = showing=20 some plots of times and locations.
 
http://aslww= w.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/ttdata.shtml
 
Randy
Subject: seismometer/site sensitivity From: Jan Froom JDarwin@............. Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:35:32 -0700 I'm curious how many of you have come up with a "rule of thumb" for the general sensitivity of your seismometers. For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out from my seismometer, and have seen 5s within 300 miles. And I understand we should be able to sense a 7 anywhere in the world. But just now, I did not see a 1.3 seven miles out. So my question.... is this good, bad, average? I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of instrument, orientation, ambient noise, etc.. but still, shouldn't there be a general feeling or rule of thumb. Jan in Gilroy I'm curious how many of you have come up with a "rule of thumb" for the general sensitivity of your seismometers.

For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out from my seismometer, and have seen 5s within 300 miles.
And I understand we should be able to sense a 7 anywhere in the world.
But just now, I did not see a 1.3  seven miles out.
So my question.... is this good, bad, average?
I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of instrument, orientation, ambient noise, etc..
but still, shouldn't there be a general feeling or rule of thumb.

Jan in Gilroy
Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: Pete Rowe ptrowe@......... Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:45:49 -0700 (PDT) Hi Jan I'd say that you are doing just fine. With my 3 second period horizontal I see 5s down in Mexico, 7s anywhere, but a 1.3 needs to be with in 3 or 4 miles. I have never gone to the trouble of actually trying to calibrate mine because I really don't know how to do it and haven't taken the time to learn. The gain numbers that I use in Larry's program are just guesses. 73, Pete --- Jan Froom wrote: > I'm curious how many of you have come up with a > "rule of thumb" for the > general sensitivity of your seismometers. > > For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out > from my seismometer, > and have seen 5s within 300 miles. > And I understand we should be able to sense a 7 > anywhere in the world. > But just now, I did not see a 1.3 seven miles out. > So my question.... is this good, bad, average? > I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of > instrument, > orientation, ambient noise, etc.. > but still, shouldn't there be a general feeling or > rule of thumb. > > Jan in Gilroy > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Tonight's top picks. What will you watch tonight? Preview the hottest shows on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3n_Fr=EDmann?= jonfr@......... Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 20:46:58 +0000 Hi Small earthquakes can be difficault to detect. But for me the general rule is that the less background noise there is, the bigger the chance of seeing small earthquake is. More background noise, less chance. I have seen earthquakes down to 1.0 or smaller up to a distance of ~55 km. After that, it is really a hard to see small earthquakes. Regards. --=20 J=F3n Fr=EDmann http://www.jonfr.com http://earthquakes.jonfr.com http://www.net303.net http://www.mobile-coverage.com/ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: Larry Conklin lconklin@............ Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 17:28:01 -0400 I have a spreadsheet that I have been using for several years to log the events that I've been able to record. It includes a scatterplot of magnitude versus distance. In addition, I assign a rough "quality" score to the events (A - D) that is used to determine the color of the points plotted. I live in central NY, so the vast majority of events that I see are at teleseismic distances, and frustratingly, a very high percentage of the stuff I see is at distances that put me in the shadow zone. I am very definitely limited by some mix of environmental noise and very possibly some sort of spruious system noise that I don't really understand. If anyone is interested in seeing my accumulated results, I would be happy to send them a copy of the spreadsheet. Larry Conklin Liverpool, NY lconklin@............ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: "Geoff" gmvoeth@........... Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 02:15:00 -0700 I have a vertical setup with a sensor that seems to have a sensitivity of 1.5 to 2 volts per inches per second and I can see a magnitude 4 about 6 degrees away. or so it seems. I am using heavy damping to allow me to use a single bandpass filter to equalize the freq response of a one hertz geophone somewhere between 4 seconds and 2 Hz. The geophone is buried underground on a granite tile with the base of the geophone maybe 24 inches below ground. Sealed to the best of my abilities against temp and moisture and electro/magnetic fields. My area here is extremely noisy from vehicular traffic as well as electrical disturbances. My station is not a very good one but will at least let me know when a major event happens. The USGS was not interested in signals from this station unless my times were the very first and that is so very rare. Commonly the local signals are mine blasts which they seem to have no interest in also. The USGS seems to have there own setup that does not seem to miss anything at all. You need a friend there to look for signals you might see at your amature station that are not earth quakes. They are busy people there i believe with no lower level help doing any analysis. You most probably shall have troubles identifying small stuff since you need several signatures to compare. You got to compare your signals with the USGS to get an idea what your MDL ( minimum dicernable level) really is. It will take time. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Froom" To: Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 12:35 PM Subject: seismometer/site sensitivity > I'm curious how many of you have come up with a "rule of thumb" for the > general sensitivity of your seismometers. > > For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out from my seismometer, > and have seen 5s within 300 miles. > And I understand we should be able to sense a 7 anywhere in the world. > But just now, I did not see a 1.3 seven miles out. > So my question.... is this good, bad, average? > I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of instrument, > orientation, ambient noise, etc.. > but still, shouldn't there be a general feeling or rule of thumb. > > Jan in Gilroy > __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: ChrisAtUpw@....... Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 07:07:11 EDT In a message dated 12/10/2007, gmvoeth@........... writes: I have a vertical setup with a sensor that seems to have a sensitivity of 1.5 to 2 volts per inches per second and I can see a magnitude 4 about 6 degrees away. or so it seems. I am using heavy damping to allow me to use a single bandpass filter to equalize the freq response of a one hertz geophone somewhere between 4 seconds and 2 Hz. Hi Geoff, You need to use negative impedance input to get broad band response from a geophone by heavy damping to mostly cancel out the internal resistance. You then need a very low noise 1/f amplifier to give you a flat to velocity response. The technique is dscribed with references at _http://www.lennartz-electronic.de/MamboV4.5.2/downloads/Seismometers.pdf_ (http://www.lennartz-electronic.de/MamboV4.5.2/downloads/Seismometers.pdf) Regards, Chris Chapman
In a message dated 12/10/2007, gmvoeth@........... writes:
<= FONT=20 style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size= =3D2>I have a=20 vertical setup with a sensor that seems to have a sensitivity of 1.5 to 2=20 volts per inches per second and I can see a magnitude 4 about 6 degrees aw= ay.=20 or so it seems. I am using heavy damping to allow me to use a single bandp= ass=20 filter to equalize the freq response of a one hertz geophone somewher= e=20 between 4 seconds and 2 Hz.
 
Hi Geoff,
 
    You need to use negative impedance input to get= =20 broad band response from a geophone by heavy damping to mostly cancel out th= e=20 internal resistance. You then need a very low noise 1/f amplifier to give yo= u a=20 flat to velocity response.
    The technique is dscribed with references at http://www.lennartz-electronic.de/MamboV4.5.2/downloads/Seismometers.p= df
 
    Regards,
 
    Chris Chapman
Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: "Connie and Jim Lehman" lehmancj@........... Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 11:27:14 -0400 Jan. I believe your system is in the "ball-park" in performance. I = don't know what design you are working with, or your exact location. = With our experience with a long-period cantilever (l8 sec) period, we = generally read 3.0 events --here in Virginia, some quarry blasts, not = many natural events here!. Anything Mag. 5 and above in the U.S. = Alaska, and much of Central and South America. Anything Mag.. 6 or more = worldwide. Of course events in South Pacific outnumbered the rest of = the World for us. The ideal was when we ran two identical sensors = broadside N-S and E-W. We generally let microseisms decide the = amplitude setting. In our summertime here in VA. the microseisms are = lower (for whatever reasons??) and we could crank up the daily gains, = and for a two month summer recording with two sensors we received our = record of 62 events in 60 days. That was years ago, and I haven't tried = a repeat. Best wishes, Jim Lehman ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jan Froom=20 To: psn-l@................. Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 3:35 PM Subject: seismometer/site sensitivity I'm curious how many of you have come up with a "rule of thumb" for = the general sensitivity of your seismometers. For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out from my seismometer, = and have seen 5s within 300 miles. And I understand we should be able to sense a 7 anywhere in the world. But just now, I did not see a 1.3 seven miles out. So my question.... is this good, bad, average?=20 I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of instrument, = orientation, ambient noise, etc..=20 but still, shouldn't there be a general feeling or rule of thumb. Jan in Gilroy
Jan.  I believe your system is in = the=20 "ball-park" in performance.  I don't know what design you are = working with,=20 or your exact location.  With our experience with a long-period = cantilever=20 (l8 sec) period, we generally read 3.0 events --here in Virginia, some = quarry=20 blasts, not many natural events here!.  Anything Mag. 5 and above = in the=20 U.S. Alaska, and much of Central and South America.  = Anything=20 Mag.. 6 or more worldwide.   Of course events in South Pacific = outnumbered the rest of the World for us.  The ideal was when = we=20 ran two identical sensors broadside N-S and E-W.  We generally = let=20 microseisms decide the amplitude setting.  In our summertime here = in VA.=20 the microseisms are lower (for whatever reasons??) and we could crank up = the=20 daily gains, and for a two month summer recording with two sensors we = received=20 our record of 62 events in 60 days.  That was years ago, and I = haven't=20 tried a repeat.
        =20 Best wishes,    Jim Lehman
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Jan=20 Froom
Sent: Thursday, October 11, = 2007 3:35=20 PM
Subject: seismometer/site=20 sensitivity

I'm curious how many = of you=20 have come up with a "rule of thumb" for the general sensitivity of = your=20 seismometers.

For instance I have sensed a 3.0 sixty miles out = from my=20 seismometer, and have seen 5s within 300 miles.
And I understand we = should=20 be able to sense a 7 anywhere in the world.
But just now, I did not = see a=20 1.3  seven miles out.
So my question.... is this good, bad, = average?=20
I'm sure there are lots of variables such as type of instrument,=20 orientation, ambient noise, etc..
but still, shouldn't there be a = general=20 feeling or rule of thumb.

Jan in=20 Gilroy
Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity From: Bobhelenmcclure@....... Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2007 21:29:59 EDT Hi Geoff, There is a better way to extend the response of a 1 Hz geophone, or any open loop sensor. Try the period extending filter in WQFilter.exe. Use normal damping. The filter can extend the period by a factor of 8 or more on major events. This is a digital inverse filter, whose gain is shaped to preserve normal gain at high frequencies and to supply the gain needed at frequencies below the natural frequency of the sensor. The utility can be downloaded from _http://www.jclahr.com/science/psn/mcclure/sac/index.html_ (http://www.jclahr.com/science/psn/mcclure/sac/index.html) This program includes high-pass and low-pass Butterworth filters which perform better than those supposedly IIR BW filters in WinQuake. I have learned never to use WinQuake's filters. I use the lowest order, order 2, both directions for high-pass filtering. Extended period filtering works best if you select the option "LONG PERIOD plus HPF". Additional high-pass filtering is usually unnecessary if you use that option. Even long period period Lehman sensors can benefit from proper use of WQFilter, as it can compensate for over- or under-damping. It can make the filtered long period response either longer or shorter than the actual sensor period. On an unrelated note, those of you who use HP calculators with Reverse Polish Notation will like the following freeware calculator for your PC desktop: _http://www.tordivel.no/xcalc/_ (http://www.tordivel.no/xcalc/) Bob In a message dated 12/10/2007, gmvoeth@.... writes: I have a vertical setup with a sensor that seems to have a sensitivity of 1.5 to 2 volts per inches per second and I can see a magnitude 4 about 6 degrees away. or so it seems. I am using heavy damping to allow me to use a single bandpass filter to equalize the freq response of a one hertz geophone somewhere between 4 seconds and 2 Hz. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
Hi Geoff,
 
  There is a better way to extend the response of a 1 Hz geophone,= or=20 any open loop sensor. Try the period extending filter in WQFilter.exe. Use=20 normal damping. The filter can extend the period by a factor of 8 or more on= =20 major events. This is a digital inverse filter, whose gain is shaped to pres= erve=20 normal gain at high frequencies and to supply the gain needed at frequencies= =20 below the natural frequency of the sensor. The utility can be downloaded=20 from
 
   http://www= ..jclahr.com/science/psn/mcclure/sac/index.html
 
  This program includes high-pass and low-pass Butterworth filters= =20 which perform better than those supposedly IIR BW filters in WinQuake. I hav= e=20 learned never to use WinQuake's filters. I use the lowest order, order 2, bo= th=20 directions for high-pass filtering. Extended period filtering works bes= t if=20 you select the option "LONG PERIOD plus HPF". Additional high-pass filtering= is=20 usually unnecessary if you use that option. Even long period period Lehman=20 sensors can benefit from proper use of WQFilter, as it can compensate for ov= er-=20 or under-damping. It can make the filtered long period response either longe= r or=20 shorter than the actual sensor period.
 
  On an unrelated note, those of you who use HP calculators with=20 Reverse Polish Notation will like the following freeware calculator for your= PC=20 desktop:
 
 http://www.tordivel.no/xcalc/
 
Bob
 
In a message dated 12/10/2007, gmvoeth@.... writes:
 
I have a  vertical setup with a sensor that seems to have a=20 sensitivity of
1.5 to 2  volts per inches per second and I can see=20= a=20 magnitude 4 about 6
degrees away.  or so it seems. I am using heavy= =20 damping to allow me to use a single
bandpass  filter to equalize th= e=20 freq response of a one hertz geophone
somewhere  between 4 seconds=20= and=20 2 Hz.



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= Subject: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3n_Fr=EDmann?= jonfr@......... Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 14:36:34 +0000 Hi all I have a friend how lives in Albany, N.Y in the U.S. He tells me that he felt two earthquake like shocks around 2 am local time, they where each with about five min, intervals. I did look for earthquakes on the usgs web page but I didn't find anything there. Regards. --=20 J=F3n Fr=EDmann http://www.jonfr.com http://earthquakes.jonfr.com http://www.net303.net http://www.mobile-coverage.com/ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: Stephen & Kathy skmort@............ Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 08:24:59 -0700 If we are talking about this morning, about 6:00 UTC, I see nothing on = the N/E USA webicorders??? http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/heli2_us.shtml Stephen J=F3n Fr=EDmann wrote: > Hi all > > I have a friend how lives in Albany, N.Y in the U.S. He tells me that h= e > felt two earthquake like shocks around 2 am local time, they where each= > with about five min, intervals. > > I did look for earthquakes on the usgs web page but I didn't find > anything there. > > Regards. > =20 If we are talking about this morning,=A0 about 6:00= UTC,=A0 I see nothing on the N/E USA webicorders???

http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/heli2_us.= shtml
=A0 Stephen

J=F3n Fr=EDmann wrote: 
Hi all

I have a friend how lives in Albany, N.Y in the U.S. He tells me that he
felt two earthquake like shocks around 2 am local time, they where each
with about five min, intervals.

I did look for earthquakes on the usgs web page but I didn't find
anything there.

Regards.
Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: Bob Hancock carpediem1@......... Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 08:43:02 -0700 Hi Jon - Here is a link to the other stations at Lamont-Daugherty. Click on station HCNY. It is located about 30 miles west of Albany, NY, and UTC time is located on the right side of the chart. http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/view_pal.html Bob Hancock On 10/14/07 7:36 AM, "J=F3n Fr=EDmann" wrote: > Hi all >=20 > I have a friend how lives in Albany, N.Y in the U.S. He tells me that he > felt two earthquake like shocks around 2 am local time, they where each > with about five min, intervals. >=20 > I did look for earthquakes on the usgs web page but I didn't find > anything there. >=20 > Regards. __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: "Thomas Dick" dickthomas01@............. Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 07:00:15 -0500 Midwest network indicates a 1.5 mag at Tupper Lake NY see at ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Hancock" To: Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2007 10:43 AM Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? Hi Jon - Here is a link to the other stations at Lamont-Daugherty. Click on station HCNY. It is located about 30 miles west of Albany, NY, and UTC time is located on the right side of the chart. http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/view_pal.html Bob Hancock On 10/14/07 7:36 AM, "Jón Frímann" wrote: > Hi all > > I have a friend how lives in Albany, N.Y in the U.S. He tells me that he > felt two earthquake like shocks around 2 am local time, they where each > with about five min, intervals. > > I did look for earthquakes on the usgs web page but I didn't find > anything there. > > Regards. __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: "Thomas Dick" dickthomas01@............. Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 07:03:37 -0500 Midwest network shows a 1.5 meg earthquake at Tupper Lake, NY see details at http://folkworm.ceri.memphis.edu/recenteqs/Quakes/quakes0.html __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: RE: seismometer/site sensitivity From: "Chuck Boudreaux" chuckbou@............. Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 10:36:53 -0500 Larry, I would like a copy of the spreadsheet when you get a chance. Chuck Boudreaux Berwick, LA chuckbou@............. -----Original Message----- From: psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... On Behalf Of Larry Conklin Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 16:28 To: PSN List Subject: Re: seismometer/site sensitivity I have a spreadsheet that I have been using for several years to log the events that I've been able to record. It includes a scatterplot of magnitude versus distance. In addition, I assign a rough "quality" score to the events (A - D) that is used to determine the color of the points plotted. I live in central NY, so the vast majority of events that I see are at teleseismic distances, and frustratingly, a very high percentage of the stuff I see is at distances that put me in the shadow zone. I am very definitely limited by some mix of environmental noise and very possibly some sort of spruious system noise that I don't really understand. If anyone is interested in seeing my accumulated results, I would be happy to send them a copy of the spreadsheet. Larry Conklin Liverpool, NY lconklin@............ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Earthquake near Albany, NY, U.S ? From: "Thomas Dick" dickthomas01@............. Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 14:23:38 -0500 Midwest area recorded two quakes this weekend see http://folkworm.ceri.memphis.edu/recenteqs/Quakes/quakes0.html __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Octorber From: tchannel1@............ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 09:24:38 -0600 Hi Folks, By my counts, the next two weeks could be very active, or the = month of October is going to be the quietest month this year. Obviously no one can look into the future, but I am convinced the counts = of events do form totals which seem to repeat, month after month. I sure wish I knew more about probabilities, perhaps I could qualify my = observation. My equipment does not record many of the smaller events. = Discounting those smaller events, here are my notes. My monthly average is 16 Lowest month.............12 Highest month............19 October.......................3 If the month of October, DOES play = catch up, the next two weeks are going to be very active. If the month = of October DOESN'T, then please dismiss all of the above as the ranting = of a grumpy old man. Cheers, Ted
Hi Folks,  By my counts, the next = two=20 weeks could be very active, or the month of October is going to be = the=20 quietest month this year.
Obviously no one can look into the = future, but I am=20 convinced the counts of events do form totals which seem to repeat, = month after=20 month.
I sure wish I knew more about = probabilities,=20 perhaps I could qualify my observation.   My equipment does = not record=20 many of the smaller events.  Discounting those smaller events, here = are my notes.
 
My monthly average is 16
Lowest = month.............12
Highest = month............19
October.......................3      = If the=20 month of October, DOES play catch up, the next two weeks are going to be = very=20 active.  If the month of October DOESN'T, then please dismiss all = of the=20 above as the ranting of a grumpy old man.
 
Cheers,
Ted
Subject: Re: Octorber From: Dave Nelson davenn@............... Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 06:53:42 +1000 Depends on where you have been living Ted, ;) Down in this part of the world its been VERY active so far this month .... definately the busiest for a long long time. The New Zealand region has truely lived up to its name of " The Shakey Isles" Here's a brief list of the M5+ events.... M5.6 upper Sth Is M5.7 upper Nth Is M5.1 upper Nth Is M54 offshr SW of Sth Is ashk of the M7+ and M6+ events on the last day of the previous month M6.7 Fiordland, Sth Is M6.2 Fiordland, Sth Is M5.8 Fiordland, Sth Is M6.2 Fiordland, Sth Is M5.1 Fiordland, Sth Is M6.5 NW of Raoul Is, to the nth of NZ but well felt in Nth Is. of NZ not to mention the dozens of good aftershocks and other 4.0-4.9 events around the country At 01:24 AM 10/19/2007, you wrote: >Hi Folks, By my counts, the next two weeks could be very active, or the >month of October is going to be the quietest month this year. >Obviously no one can look into the future, but I am convinced the counts >of events do form totals which seem to repeat, month after month. >I sure wish I knew more about probabilities, perhaps I could qualify my >observation. My equipment does not record many of the smaller >events. Discounting those smaller events, here are my notes. > >My monthly average is 16 >Lowest month.............12 >Highest month............19 >October.......................3 If the month of October, DOES play >catch up, the next two weeks are going to be very active. If the month of >October DOESN'T, then please dismiss all of the above as the ranting of a >grumpy old man. > >Cheers, >Ted > > >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.0/1077 - Release Date: >10/18/2007 9:54 AM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.0/1077 - Release Date: 10/18/2007 9:54 AM __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Octorber From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F3n_Fr=EDmann?= jonfr@......... Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 02:57:27 +0000 Hi all In my part of the world, the whole year has been quiet on the earthquake front. Some weeks I don't even record a single earthquake. Regards. -- J=F3n Fr=EDmann http://www.jonfr.com http://earthquakes.jonfr.com http://www.net303.net http://www.mobile-coverage.com/ __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: "Jerry Payton" gpayton880@....... Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:56:15 -0500 OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some discussion! Regards, Jerry Payton ----- Original Message ----- From: meredith lamb To: psn-l@.............. Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? Hi all, I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real "engineers"; to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures of a item at: http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's yours? Meredith Lamb
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this = cat. =20 It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  I've seen no = replies=20 to your question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's.  = Let's=20 stir up some discussion!
Regards,
Jerry Payton
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: meredith=20 lamb
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM
Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry=20 uses/s?

Hi all,
 
I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real=20 "engineers";
to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures = of a=20 item at:
 
http://home.earthlink.n= et/~meredithlamb/
 
I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's = yours?
 
Meredith Lamb
 
 
Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: tchannel1@............ Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:11:04 -0600 Jerry, You've got that right................This is my slowest month = for a year, day after day very uninteresting screens. Maybe tomorrow? Since I have no earthquakes to discuss...........Could this device be a = support for a large dia. pipe? As a part of a Seismic device, here is my suggestion: Get a large piece of white butcher paper 48" x 48" Draw a center point = on the piece of paper, using a black #2 pencil, connecting two opposite = diagonal corners. Carefully position one corner of the paper facing true north and the = opposite corner south. Place this device in the center of the paper and align it's support = shaft along the N/S axis. Trace the profile of the entire device on to the paper using the black = #2 pencil. Wait for a large earthquake, >7 M, closer than 100 miles. After the large event, retrace the new position of the device's profile, = using a red #2 Pencil. Comparing the original position profile with the new position profile, = one may be able to plot the general direction of the epicenter, and = estimate the magnitude. Unless it move greater than 24" from center. Thanks,=20 Ted ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jerry Payton=20 To: psn-l@................. Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 9:56 AM Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds = me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your = question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up = some discussion! Regards, Jerry Payton ----- Original Message -----=20 From: meredith lamb=20 To: psn-l@................. Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? Hi all, I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real = "engineers";=20 to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures of = a item at: http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's yours? Meredith Lamb
Jerry,  You've got that=20 right................This is my slowest month for a year, day after day = very=20 uninteresting screens.   Maybe tomorrow?
Since I have no earthquakes to=20 discuss...........Could this device be a support for a large dia.=20 pipe?
 
As a part of a Seismic device, here is = my=20 suggestion:
Get a large piece of white butcher = paper 48" x 48"=20 Draw a center point on the piece of paper, using a black #2 pencil, = connecting=20 two opposite diagonal corners.
Carefully position one corner of the = paper facing=20 true north and the opposite corner south.
Place this device in the center of the = paper and=20 align it's support shaft along the N/S axis.
Trace the profile of the entire device = on to the=20 paper using the black #2 pencil.
 
Wait for a large earthquake, >7 M, = closer than=20 100 miles.
After the large event, retrace the new = position of=20 the device's profile, using a red #2 Pencil.
Comparing the original = position profile with=20 the new position profile, one may be able to plot the general = direction of=20 the epicenter, and estimate the magnitude.  Unless it move greater = than 24"=20 from center.
Thanks,
Ted
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Jerry = Payton=20
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, = 2007 9:56=20 AM
Subject: Re: Mystery item and = its=20 potential seismometry uses/s?

OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this=20 cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  = I've=20 seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right = now in=20 EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion!
Regards,
Jerry Payton
 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: meredith=20 lamb
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM
Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry=20 uses/s?

Hi all,
 
I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real=20 "engineers";
to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple = pictures of a=20 item at:
 
http://home.earthlink.n= et/~meredithlamb/
 
I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's = yours?
 
Meredith Lamb
 
 
Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: "meredith lamb" paleoartifact@......... Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 20:09:43 -0600 Hi Jerry and all, I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum (horizontal sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other vertical sensing use/s. The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type. The aluminum looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer setups....without...as much material being used. Fun stuff! See: http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ Take care, Meredith Lamb On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton wrote: > > *OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me > of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your > question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some > discussion!* > *Regards,* > *Jerry Payton* > ** >
Hi Jerry and all,
 
I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum (horizontal
sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other vertical sensing
use/s.  The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type.  The aluminum
looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer setups....without...as much
material being used.  Fun stuff!  See:
 
 
Take care, Meredith Lamb

 
On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton <gpayton880@.......> wrote:
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  I've seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion!
Regards,
Jerry Payton
 
Subject: RE: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: "Steve Hammond" shammon1@............. Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:24:27 -0700 Hi, The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a round object such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance = device that reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using = a counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the = wave energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow = the base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast increasing the effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some patents that describe = this idea. www.freepatentsonline.com/CCL-114-122.html=20 =20 My guess, Steve Hammond -----Original Message----- From: psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... = On Behalf Of meredith lamb Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 7:10 PM To: psn-l@.............. Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? Hi Jerry and all, =20 I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum (horizontal sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other vertical sensing use/s. The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type. The aluminum looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer = setups....without...as much material being used. Fun stuff! See: =20 http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ =20 Take care, Meredith Lamb =20 On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton wrote:=20 OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me = of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your = question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some discussion!=20 Regards, Jerry Payton =20 Message
Hi,=20 The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a = round object=20 such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance device = that=20 reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using a=20 counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the = wave=20 energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow = the=20 base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast = increasing=20 the effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some = patents that=20 describe this idea. www.freepatent= sonline.com/CCL-114-122.html=20
 
 My guess, Steve Hammond
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... = On=20 Behalf Of meredith lamb
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, = 2007 7:10=20 PM
To: psn-l@..............
Subject: Re: Mystery = item and=20 its potential seismometry uses/s?

Hi Jerry and all,
 
I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual = pendulum=20 (horizontal
sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to = its other=20 vertical sensing
use/s.  The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G"=20 type.  The aluminum
looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer=20 setups....without...as much
material being used.  Fun stuff!  See:
 
http://home.earthlink.n= et/~meredithlamb/
 
Take care, Meredith Lamb

 
On 10/24/07, Jerry=20 Payton <gpayton880@.......>=20 wrote:=20
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got = this=20 cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you = idea?  I've=20 seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right = now in=20 EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion!
Regards,
Jerry Payton
=
 
Subject: Re: Digest from 10/24/2007 00:00:50 From: Randall Peters PETERS_RD@.......... Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 08:59:01 -0400 It's a neat piece , Meredith; however, I see a serious problem with bearing friction when it comes to use in a seismometer. Rolling friction is really complex, as evidenced by the paper I wrote at http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0506143 My expectation is that you will find challenges due to `stiction' since the decay of your system (independent of damping that you supply to the instrument by design) is more in the category of Coulomb friction than forms that result in exponential decay. As is well known for Coulomb friction, the static coefficient is greater than the kinetic coefficient. Consequently, you would probably need to provide some way to dither your instrument to have much in the way of sensitivity. Randall Peters psn-l-digest-request@.............. wrote: > .------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------. > | Message 1 | > '------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------' > Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > From: "Jerry Payton" > Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:56:15 -0500 > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C8162C.7F61FF40 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="Windows-1252" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me of > an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your question > and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some > discussion! > Regards, > Jerry Payton > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: meredith lamb > To: psn-l@.............. > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM > Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > > Hi all, > > I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real > "engineers"; > to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures of a item > at: > > http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ > > I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's yours? > > Meredith Lamb > > ------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C8162C.7F61FF40 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="Windows-1252" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > charset=3Dwindows-1252"> > > > > >
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this = > cat. =20 > It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  I've seen no = > replies=20 > to your question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's.  = > Let's=20 > stir up some discussion!
>
Regards,
>
Jerry Payton
>
 
>
----- Original Message -----=20 >
From: title=3Dpaleoartifact@......... = > href=3D"mailto:paleoartifact@.........">meredith=20 > lamb
> >
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM
>
Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry=20 > uses/s?
>

>
Hi all,
>
 
>
I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real=20 > "engineers";
>
to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures = > of a=20 > item at:
>
 
>
href=3D"http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/">http://home.earthlink.n= > et/~meredithlamb/
>
 
>
I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's = > yours?
>
 
>
Meredith Lamb
>
 
>
 
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C8162C.7F61FF40-- > > .------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------. > | Message 2 | > '------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------' > Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > From: > Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:11:04 -0600 > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8162E.914B0A60 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="Windows-1252" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > Jerry, You've got that right................This is my slowest month = > for a year, day after day very uninteresting screens. Maybe tomorrow? > Since I have no earthquakes to discuss...........Could this device be a = > support for a large dia. pipe? > > As a part of a Seismic device, here is my suggestion: > Get a large piece of white butcher paper 48" x 48" Draw a center point = > on the piece of paper, using a black #2 pencil, connecting two opposite = > diagonal corners. > Carefully position one corner of the paper facing true north and the = > opposite corner south. > Place this device in the center of the paper and align it's support = > shaft along the N/S axis. > Trace the profile of the entire device on to the paper using the black = > #2 pencil. > > Wait for a large earthquake, >7 M, closer than 100 miles. > After the large event, retrace the new position of the device's profile, = > using a red #2 Pencil. > Comparing the original position profile with the new position profile, = > one may be able to plot the general direction of the epicenter, and = > estimate the magnitude. Unless it move greater than 24" from center. > Thanks,=20 > Ted > > ----- Original Message -----=20 > From: Jerry Payton=20 > To: psn-l@................. > Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 9:56 AM > Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > > OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds = > me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your = > question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up = > some discussion! > Regards, > Jerry Payton > > ----- Original Message -----=20 > From: meredith lamb=20 > To: psn-l@................. > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM > Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > > Hi all, > > I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real = > "engineers";=20 > to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple pictures of = > a item at: > > http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ > > I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's yours? > > Meredith Lamb > > ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8162E.914B0A60 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="Windows-1252" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > charset=3Dwindows-1252"> > > > > >
Jerry,  You've got that=20 > right................This is my slowest month for a year, day after day = > very=20 > uninteresting screens.   Maybe tomorrow?
>
Since I have no earthquakes to=20 > discuss...........Could this device be a support for a large dia.=20 > pipe?
>
 
>
As a part of a Seismic device, here is = > my=20 > suggestion:
>
Get a large piece of white butcher = > paper 48" x 48"=20 > Draw a center point on the piece of paper, using a black #2 pencil, = > connecting=20 > two opposite diagonal corners.
>
Carefully position one corner of the = > paper facing=20 > true north and the opposite corner south.
>
Place this device in the center of the = > paper and=20 > align it's support shaft along the N/S axis.
>
Trace the profile of the entire device = > on to the=20 > paper using the black #2 pencil.
>
 
>
Wait for a large earthquake, >7 M, = > closer than=20 > 100 miles.
>
After the large event, retrace the new = > position of=20 > the device's profile, using a red #2 Pencil.
>
Comparing the original = > position profile with=20 > the new position profile, one may be able to plot the general = > direction of=20 > the epicenter, and estimate the magnitude.  Unless it move greater = > than 24"=20 > from center.
>
Thanks,
>
Ted
>
 
>
 
>
----- Original Message -----
>
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = > BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> > style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = > black">From:=20 > Jerry = > Payton=20 > > >
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, = > 2007 9:56=20 > AM
>
Subject: Re: Mystery item and = > its=20 > potential seismometry uses/s?
>

>
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this=20 > cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  = > I've=20 > seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right = > now in=20 > EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion!
>
Regards,
>
Jerry Payton
>
 
>
----- Original Message -----=20 >
From: title=3Dpaleoartifact@......... = > href=3D"mailto:paleoartifact@.........">meredith=20 > lamb
> >
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 8:28 PM
>
Subject: Mystery item and its potential seismometry=20 > uses/s?
>

>
Hi all,
>
 
>
I think it might be fun for those of you who are amateur or real=20 > "engineers";
>
to come up with their own thoughts and use/s for a couple = > pictures of a=20 > item at:
>
 
>
= > href=3D"http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/">http://home.earthlink.n= > et/~meredithlamb/
>
 
>
I have my own (surprising) and varied uses in mind; what's = > yours?
>
 
>
Meredith Lamb
>
 
>
 
> > ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C8162E.914B0A60-- > > .------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------. > | Message 3 | > '------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------' > Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > From: "meredith lamb" > Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 20:09:43 -0600 > > ------=_Part_9710_24185849.1193278183386 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > > Hi Jerry and all, > > I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum > (horizontal > sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other > vertical sensing > use/s. The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type. The > aluminum > looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer setups....without...as > much > material being used. Fun stuff! See: > > http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ > > Take care, Meredith Lamb > > On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton wrote: > > > > *OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me > > of an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your > > question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some > > discussion!* > > *Regards,* > > *Jerry Payton* > > ** > > > > ------=_Part_9710_24185849.1193278183386 > Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Disposition: inline > >
Hi Jerry and all,
>
 
>
I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum (horizontal
>
sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other vertical sensing
>
use/s.  The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type.  The aluminum
>
looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer setups....without...as much
>
material being used.  Fun stuff!  See:
>
 
> >
 
>
Take care, Meredith Lamb

 
>
On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton <gpayton880@.......> wrote: >
>
>
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got this cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you idea?  I've seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion! >
>
Regards,
>
Jerry Payton
>
 
> > ------=_Part_9710_24185849.1193278183386-- > > .------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------. > | Message 4 | > '------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------ ------' > Subject: RE: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > From: "Steve Hammond" > Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:24:27 -0700 > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C81695.060A0FC0 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > Hi, The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a round > object such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance = > device > that reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using = > a > counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the = > wave > energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow = > the > base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast increasing the > effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some patents that describe = > this > idea. www.freepatentsonline.com/CCL-114-122.html=20 > =20 > My guess, Steve Hammond > > -----Original Message----- > From: psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... = > On > Behalf Of meredith lamb > Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 7:10 PM > To: psn-l@.............. > Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? > > Hi Jerry and all, > =20 > I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual pendulum > (horizontal > sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to its other > vertical sensing > use/s. The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G" type. The > aluminum > looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer = > setups....without...as > much > material being used. Fun stuff! See: > =20 > http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ > =20 > Take care, Meredith Lamb > > =20 > On 10/24/07, Jerry Payton wrote:=20 > > OK, Meredith. I give up and curiosity has got this cat. It reminds me = > of > an oar-lock, but what was you idea? I've seen no replies to your = > question > and there seems to be a lull right now in EQ's. Let's stir up some > discussion!=20 > Regards, > Jerry Payton > > =20 > > ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C81695.060A0FC0 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > charset=3Dus-ascii"> > Message > > > >
size=3D2>Hi,=20 > The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a = > round object=20 > such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance device = > that=20 > reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using a=20 > counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the = > wave=20 > energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow = > the=20 > base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast = > increasing=20 > the effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some = > patents that=20 > describe this idea.  href=3D"http://www.freepatentsonline.com/CCL-114-122.html">www.freepatent= > sonline.com/CCL-114-122.html=20 >
>
size=3D2> class=3Da> 
>
> size=3D2> My guess, Steve Hammond
>
>
>
align=3Dleft> face=3DTahoma size=3D2>-----Original Message-----
From:=20 > psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... = > On=20 > Behalf Of meredith lamb
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, = > 2007 7:10=20 > PM
To: psn-l@..............
Subject: Re: Mystery = > item and=20 > its potential seismometry uses/s?

>
Hi Jerry and all,
>
 
>
I put up some text and 3 more pictures of a rather unusual = > pendulum=20 > (horizontal
>
sensing), on the web, and some very brief text relating to = > its other=20 > vertical sensing
>
use/s.  The pendulum is essentially a hanging mass or "S-G"=20 > type.  The aluminum
>
looks to be quite useful for a variety of seismometer=20 > setups....without...as much
>
material being used.  Fun stuff!  See:
>
 
>
= > href=3D"http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/">http://home.earthlink.n= > et/~meredithlamb/
>
 
>
Take care, Meredith Lamb

 
>
On 10/24/07, class=3Dgmail_sendername>Jerry=20 > Payton < href=3D"mailto:gpayton880@.......">gpayton880@.......>=20 > wrote:=20 >
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: = > #ccc 1px solid"> >
>
OK, Meredith.  I give up and curiosity has got = > this=20 > cat.  It reminds me of an oar-lock, but what was you = > idea?  I've=20 > seen no replies to your question and there seems to be a lull right = > now in=20 > EQ's.  Let's stir up some discussion!
>
Regards,
>
Jerry Payton
> = >
 
QUOTE> > > ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C81695.060A0FC0-- > > __________________________________________________________ > > Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) > > To leave this list email PSN-L-DIGEST-REQUEST@.............. with > the body of the message (first line only): unsubscribe > See http://www.seismicnet.com/maillist.html for more information. Subject: Peters study of complex friction From: John Lahr johnjan@........ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 07:57:02 -0700 This is an interesting point that Randall makes. I suppose if there is always some movement due to microseisms, then the static friction will not come into play... but maybe not .... at the end of each swing it may be a factor anyway, causing the response to be nonlinear. I wonder if there are also complexities of this sort in other types of hinge that involve flexure of a material? John >Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 08:59:01 -0400 >From: Randall Peters >It's a neat piece , Meredith; however, I see a serious problem with >bearing friction when it comes to use in >a seismometer. Rolling friction is really complex, as evidenced by >the paper I wrote at >http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0506143 > My expectation is that you will find challenges due to `stiction' > since the decay of your system (independent >of damping that you supply to the instrument by design) is more in >the category of Coulomb friction than >forms that result in exponential decay. As is well known for >Coulomb friction, the static coefficient is greater than the kinetic >coefficient. Consequently, you would probably need to provide some >way to dither your instrument to have much in the way of sensitivity. > >Randall Peters __________________________________________________________ Public Seismic Network Mailing List (PSN-L) Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: "meredith lamb" paleoartifact@......... Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 11:52:49 -0600 Hi Steve and all, I don't really know what the item was originally used for. The "wear" pattern only suggests a horizontal load use for this particular item. There is indeed likely a wide variety of use variations as you web referenced. Meanwhile...I've added another 6th picture and text for a crude "crossed rod" pivot using the same item. The "crossed rod" type of pivot is in my opinion much better than using ball bearings, as from past table top edge experiments; its resulting visual low level small movement response (less than 1/16") seems to be quite abit more responsive....i.e., its undampened visual movement has been known to continue for ~ 2 hours more than using a variety of ball bearings. In this picture however, it is different as the 90 degree rods serve to limit unitentional assembly displacement in the lateral axis...which is a improvement over a simple straight rod riding atop the two extended table top rods. http://home.earthlink.net/~meredithlamb/ On 10/25/07, Steve Hammond wrote: > > Hi, The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a round > object such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance device > that reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using a > counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the wave > energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow the > base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast increasing the > effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some patents that describe this > idea. www.freepatentsonline.com/CCL-114-122.html > > My guess, Steve Hammond > >
Hi Steve and all,
 
I don't really know what the item was originally used for.  The "wear" pattern
only suggests a horizontal load use for this particular item.  There is indeed likely a
wide variety of use variations as you web referenced.
 
Meanwhile...I've added another 6th picture and text for a crude "crossed rod" pivot using
the same item.  The "crossed rod" type of pivot is in my opinion much better
than using ball bearings, as from past table top edge experiments; its resulting visual
low level small movement response (less than 1/16") seems to be quite abit more responsive....i.e.,
its undampened visual movement has been known to continue for ~ 2 hours more than
using a variety of ball bearings.  In this picture however, it is different as the 90 degree rods serve
to limit unitentional assembly displacement in the lateral axis...which is a improvement over
a simple straight rod riding atop the two extended table top rods.   
 
 
 


 
On 10/25/07, Steve Hammond <shammon1@............. > wrote:
Hi, The design suggests to me that it may have been connected to a round object such as a sailboat's mast. I once read about a counter balance device that reduced the port/starboard sway when a boat is at anchor buy using a counterbalance pendulum to create an apposing force that reduces the wave energy. The rollers in the top photo suggest to me that they would allow the base object to be hoisted to the upper portion of a mast increasing the effect of the pendulum. Here is a link to some patents that describe this idea.  www.freepatentsonline.com/CCL-114-122.html
 
 My guess, Steve Hammond
Subject: Re: Digest from 10/24/2007 00:00:50 From: "meredith lamb" paleoartifact@......... Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:13:35 -0600 Hi Randall, Thanks for the email and notes. I agree that ball bearings aren't a very good pivot point as I've seen a comparison of ball bearings to a "crossed rod" pivot; i.e., the low level mass pivot response of the ball bearings was outright "locked" compared to the crossed rod pivot where mass movement is less than 1/16"....right in the neighborhood range where most seismic response occurs. I won't pretend to grasp totally all you've wrote of. I do appreciate your contributions! Take care, Meredith Lamb On 10/25/07, Randall Peters wrote: > > It's a neat piece , Meredith; however, I see a serious problem with > bearing friction when it comes to use in > a seismometer. Rolling friction is really complex, as evidenced by the > paper I wrote at > http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0506143 > My expectation is that you will find challenges due to `stiction' since > the decay of your system (independent > of damping that you supply to the instrument by design) is more in the > category of Coulomb friction than > forms that result in exponential decay. As is well known for Coulomb > friction, the static coefficient is greater than the kinetic > coefficient. Consequently, you would probably need to provide some way to > dither your instrument to have much in the way of sensitivity. > > Randall Peters > > >
Hi Randall,
 
Thanks for the email and notes.  I agree that ball bearings aren't a very good pivot point as I've seen
a comparison of ball bearings to a "crossed rod" pivot; i.e., the low level mass pivot response of the ball
bearings was outright "locked" compared to the crossed rod pivot where mass movement is less than
1/16"....right in the neighborhood range where most seismic response occurs.
 
I won't pretend to grasp totally all you've wrote of.  I do appreciate your contributions!
 
Take care, Meredith Lamb    

 
On 10/25/07, Randall Peters <PETERS_RD@..........> wrote:
It's a neat piece , Meredith; however, I see a serious problem with bearing friction when it comes to use in
a seismometer.  Rolling friction is really complex, as evidenced by the paper I wrote at
http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0506143
My expectation is that you will find challenges due to `stiction' since the decay of your system (independent
of damping that you supply to the instrument by design) is more in the category of Coulomb friction than
forms that result in exponential decay.  As is well known for Coulomb friction, the static coefficient is greater than the kinetic coefficient.  Consequently, you would probably need to provide some way to dither your instrument to have much in the way of sensitivity.

Randall Peters


Subject: Re: Mystery item and its potential seismometry uses/s? From: John Lahr johnjan@........ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 13:07:55 -0700 At 10:52 AM 10/25/2007, you wrote: >...I've added another 6th picture and text for a crude "crossed rod" >pivot using >the same item. Meredith, It would be interesting to test this arrangement of rods. I think that due to the angles, the pivot point will need to rub rather than roll. If that's the case there will be much greater friction.